"A Soldier's Story" Movie Review | The Main Ingredient With Chris Ellis Podcast - Ep.10

In this special episode of "The Main Ingredient With Chris Ellis," award-winning filmmaker Chris Ellis is joined by former US Marine Gerald Williams Jr. to delve into the 1984 classic "A Soldier's Story." This powerful film, directed by Norman Jewison, explores themes of racism and identity within a segregated WWII military unit, posing complex questions about personal integrity and systemic oppression. Chris and Gerald bring their unique perspectives to the table, analyzing how the film's narrative and historical context resonate with today's audience, while also reflecting on its cinematography and character development.

Gerald Williams Jr.'s background as a Marine adds a profound depth to the discussion, offering insights into the military ethos depicted in the film and its relevance to the struggles within armed forces then and now. The conversation also touches on the transformative performances by Howard E. Rollins Jr. and Adolph Caesar, whose portrayals bring to life the internal conflicts and external pressures faced by African American soldiers. Don't miss this engaging analysis of a film that continues to challenge and inspire viewers across generations.

Chapters

• 0:00 Military Movie Discussion
• 9:40 Racism and Military Authority
• 16:47 Racial Tension in the Military
• 21:10 The Complexities of Military Racism
• 31:10 Navigating Code-Switching in Society
• 44:32 Racial Discrimination in the Military
• 52:41 Confronting Racism in the Military
• 1:04:32 Combatting Racism and Classism in Military
• 1:10:50 Unraveling Racism in the Military
• 1:19:37 Confronting Loyalty and Betrayal
• 1:31:07 Soldiers' Desire for Battle and Sacrifice
• 1:41:49 Exploring Classism in Society
• 1:51:43 Marine Corps Stories of Struggle
• 1:57:15 Military Service and African-American Soldiers

Transcript

chris: 0:00

Is that how it is? When you're on a base that you just want to see battle 100%, seriously, you ready to get shot at 100%, because that is what you're indoctrinated with from day one. That's what they're bringing you to do. That's what you signed the contract for To volunteer any and everything up until your life. What's up y'all? I'm chris ellis, and this is the main ingredient with chris ellis.

chris: 0:44

Today we got a special guest. Matter of fact, before we even start, I'm gonna tell you right now he's from a certain branch of the military. Gerald, go ahead and tell him what branch you from, gerald Williams. I was formerly known as Sergeant Gerald Williams of the United States Marine Corps. That's what's up, man. Yeah, thank you for your service, no doubt, doubt. Thank you for the recognition. I appreciate that. Thank you.

chris: 1:05

Gerald Williams is with us today to talk about a real interesting movie 1984's A Soldier's Story. He picked it. He's from the military, he knows that life, even though this is about I think it's 1944. World War II, but we're going to get into it today. A soldier's story, 1984. What's cracking. Wow, I'm sitting here on a platform unlike no other I've ever been on. So, man, thank you, I really appreciate it. I'd be remiss if I didn't thank you for this opportunity number one. I'm actually glad that you, being from that space, you picked this movie because you would understand, you know, the ins and outs of how military life goes. Yeah, you know, even though it's a different time. Yeah, yeah, but I'm pretty sure it's similar and it's some similarities Right Now, you know, choosing this movie and really dissecting it is like wow, what are we going to do here today? Because the story itself is so telling of the Black experience in general, right, and then they painted with the background of being enlisted in the military and those two worlds combining to make this movie is, I think, what makes it so great, because there's so many levels. What people don't realize is that the military itself is a microcosm of society. Yes, where do we come from? We are members of society first before we join and then, just because we join doesn't mean everything that we did prior goes out the window foundations, we got bases, and so if you were a racist piece of shit before you join, you may continue to be that racist piece of shit after, even throughout all of the training and all of the break, because again, you're in a world, right, and the military is a snapshot and a piece of the world. So, again, that's why I chose this movie At first again, the movie was always chose this movie at first Again.

chris: 3:04

To me, the movie was always been entertaining to me. Um, yeah, cause all the heavy hitters you got in there. Oh, my God, the heavy hitters. You know Howard Rollins, you got Denzel. You got uh, robert Townsend, robert Townsend, you know.

chris: 3:22

Yes, let me ask you this before we even get into the movie okay, the other day I was watching uh boys in the hood and it was a line where uh cuba gooden told ricky while he was walking he was scratching off ticket. He said the black man has no place in in the white man's army, right, do you? I don't want to get you in trouble. No, no, no, come on with it, come on with it. Do you believe now they can't say shit? Do you believe that that's a fact? Or is that something that most black people just say Because it sounds good to say it is a black person?

chris: 3:53

Right, I think it sounds good to say as a black person and not crapping on anybody's feelings, but I am very grateful for that decision because I know what is done for my life Serving and even post military, to the benefits and the things that I have access to, you know. And so, yeah, I mean, as we're going to dissect in this movie, yes, it can be difficult and I didn't serve during that time. It's way better now, but even some, some things may still exist, right. Right, that ain't went nowhere and, again, the military is a microcosm of society, right. So, yes, you're going to face that stuff, but to say that there's no place in the military for a black man, I just can't. I can't rock with that statement, because I think we are missing out on a big thing that could actually help catapult a lot of us in our society if we take those benefits and use them and aggregate them in order to really build community, and the military could be the catalyst in order to help do that. So I would encourage more brothers and sisters to go ahead and sign up and do four fucking years you don't have to do a lifetime Do four years and now you got access and action at a lot of things that can help you post service Then where it's worth it.

chris: 5:17

We talk about GI bills, we talk about school money. We talk about all those things, the American dream, things that are supposed to help you. Catapult, whatever the word is, gets you higher. Catapult, thank you, higher, but we stay out. Black man ain't got no place in the military, but we're struggling to get those things that they give us. You know we sending babies to college every day, going in the debt. You know mom and daddy struggling or worse, if mom and daddy they're already struggling, they make the baby struggle because the child takes on the debt in order to go to school. Yes, that's what we run into now. We're having so many they talk about now, so many educated young black women. Yes, but those young black women are going into debt. Yes, they're not talking about that. They come out of school with one hundred and fifty thousand dollars, thank you. How are they going to pay it off? We're working a twenty dollar an hour job. It ain't going to happen. It ain't going to happen. It's not going to happen. So why not send your kid again?

chris: 6:17

For years, and a lot of times now, because everybody has this, this, this false narrative that I joined the military, I'm going to war, I'm going to front lines. Do you know the percentage of actual grunt on the ground? Troops in the military it's like 1%, oh damn, everybody's not going over their fucking fighter rifles. It's like winning the lotto, right? Or even if you go to war again, the Muslim military. We are there to support, to support those people. So in all those jobs that are in support, are they got to eat, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You don't get to tell cool war stories about being a cook, but guess what? You get paid the same. You get paid to say and when you get out, guess what? The GI Bill is still the same amount. You don't get more because you went and got jazzed out of it. So I need to black folks to reframe that and think about that, especially we coming from demographics. That again, if you can't send your baby to college, don't X that out. Don't let that fear of my baby's going to die, no, because we die in these streets, yeah, we die in any one. Chicago's bearing 800 a year, come on. Oakland bearing 150 a year? Come on, come on. We die regardless. We die regardless.

chris: 7:34

A little side story I went to the Marine Corps eight years, no war. I got my first combat action ribbon in Oakland, california. Wow, real shit. Wow, shootout Four, shootout, shootout. Four. Firefights one night, but that's a whole other story. Wow, okay, okay, I'm glad you added that, because I really wanted to ask you about that, because I had just seen Boys in the Hood and I'm like let me see what Gerald thinks about that point of view, because it came from John Singleton. But I've also heard black people in my lifetime say that, yes, it's the white man's war, it's the white man's war, it ain't our war. So I'm glad you, you know, put a little bit, gave a little bit more information on it, but let's get into it, ok.

chris: 8:14

Soldier story 1984 is Columbia Pictures. It's written by Charles Fuller, directed by Norman Jewishen, starring Howard Rollins as Captain Richard Davenport, adolph Caesar as Sergeant Waters. We got a lot of shit to say about Adolph Caesar. That dude was no joke and he was brilliant as an actor, brilliant. We got Art Evans as Wilkie. We got Denzel Washington as Melvin Peterson. We got Robert Townsend as Corporal Ellis yeah, ellis, you got your cousin in here. David Alan Greer is Bernard Cobb and David Harris is Tony Smalls. The budget was $6 million and it made $21 million at the box office, which is not bad in 1984. Yeah, real tough. And talking about black soldiers in the military, it's not bad, not at all, and the music was done by legendary producer Herbie Hancock, so that's also a good name.

chris: 9:13

So we're going to get into the opening scene. So it starts off at a local juke joint. The first thing you see on the screen is Patti LaBelle singing her ass off. In her heyday she was in her prime. She was giving them a concert that you joined. Yes, she was giving them a concert and they was loving it. Them soldiers was loving it. They was all getting liquored up and everything. And she was. She's playing Big Mary. Yes, that's her role was Big Mary.

chris: 9:40

And you see Sergeant Waters in there getting like pissy drunk. He drunk, drunk, right, yeah, and he gotta be, he drunk. And for those who don't know, sergeant Waters is only about 120 pounds. He a little dude, yes, and he drinking up a storm. So you know, if he ain't ate no food, it's going right into him. And also to go back into it.

chris: 10:03

This is Tynan, louisiana, 1944, world War. Uh, and also to go to go back into it. This is a time in louisiana, 1944, world war ii, correct? That's the, that's the space that we're in. Um, so it basically, uh, sergeant waters is walking down the street. Everybody's seeing him, pissy drunk, he's falling all over the place. He goes into the darkness and then they, they cut the scene until, uh, he, he's getting shot. He's getting shot by somebody. We don't know who the who, the killer is. He gets shot after he says but they still hate you, and that's that's very important in this movie. Big piece, that's a big piece of he's saying they still hate you, and I love that scene. It's like for him to bring that much emotion into that part. Yeah, knowing this is his final scene in the movie, he got snot coming out of his nose, his eyes is watering, he's crying, yes, he's stumbling, and he's still delivering the lines like shakespeare yeah, yeah, yeah, delivered. Shout out to adolf caesar man. Oh, oh, adolph Cesar man.

chris: 11:05

Unfortunately, adolph Cesar didn't live but a couple of years after this movie. I think he died in the 80s. He'd been gone a long time, yeah, but he was a great actor, yeah, and I think he brought a lot more to that because he played on the stage adaptation of the movie too. Yes, he did so. He really brought them chops and let that go in the movie. So I think that's just what made the part so much, much more better. I don't see how this movie goes without Adolph. It doesn't. Without him in it. I don't see who he can replace, who can do what he did.

chris: 11:36

And you know, off subject, I got to kind of say I grew up with a father that was almost like Adolf. You know my dad. My dad was serious In his younger days. He wasn't fucking around Buzz cut. He was also a military man in the army. Buzz cut the whole shit. My dad also similar to Adolf. He despised black people who made the black race look bad. He did not like motherfuckers like that. He just did not. Now, he wouldn't have went as far as Adolph did, like getting him shot and killed and having him hang themselves. But my father was an old Texas black man.

chris: 12:15

Spin polished yeah, you ain't providing positive influence to the black community. You don't belong in the black community. That's just the way he thought about it. That's it, I know. I know you couldn't walk in your house and be shabby. You couldn't do it. And I'm not talking about in appearance, I'm talking about in character, in character, without getting checked.

chris: 12:35

When you walked in my dad's house as a man, you had to walk in as a man, yes, sir. And if you walked in as a child, you had to have manners. Yes, yes, you wasn't running through the Ellis house. No, you weren't. You weren't making hella noise, no, you weren't. Yo, you sat at the table with your feet under it, just like, put your elbows under the table. You know Pops did not play. So I kind of understand Adolph's idea of like yo man, you know, we're trying to get some recognition and respect from these white people, yes, and certain guys who he was calling geachies you making us look stupid, you stepping in fetches and you making us look stupid. So I I understand that point of view as we go on, I understand it. So the sergeant gets killed and, um, they never show the face of the killer.

chris: 13:21

But because of the time frame that we're in, everybody on the base assumes it was a KKK. Correct, that's the easy answer, correct and as it should be, because again we're dealing with with race relations at that time, and I know I'm mixing up a little bit of history, but you know some of the race riots in Chicago. I mean, there's race riots going on all over the country, boston, chicago, oakland, yes, yes, race riots going on all over the country. Boston had them. Chicago Oakland had them, la Watts had them, and this is in the 40s, I'm not talking about the 60s. I mean they're lynching folks still at this time.

chris: 13:52

A little quick side note I remember in my service day I was in North Carolina in 2000 and I call home and my mother's like, oh my God, thank you, because she heard over the news in North Carolina about a Black Marine being lynched In the year 2000. Could you imagine how that feels to hear from you. But then she gets this news Right. You don't even know if he's human, but yeah, so again, microcosm of society, right. And the world still goes on, whether you serve it or not, and unfortunately everybody doesn't respect the fact that you earned the right to wear this uniform and, as in the movie, they really captured that sentiment just because you got, you know you are, you have put your life on the line. You sign that contract. We still don't think you worthy of it and we will take you out.

chris: 14:40

Yeah, as the movie went on, it got ugly, yeah. So now we get to the scene of Captain Davenport being on a bus, being shipped in to Louisiana, to Tynan, the city of Tynan, and he's a captain with stripes and everything. And the bus driver's like, hey, boy, boy, boy, ain't this show, stop boy. And it's just like, oh my God, I don't think, boy, they would have hung me on a tree. Yeah, I'm just not, I'm not built like that, bro. No shade, right, no shade to nobody who grew up that way. But me, being a city boy, I couldn't imagine letting somebody talk to me in that manner and just dealing with it. We just we don't have the concept, you know.

chris: 15:26

But in their defense, that was life, that was normal life. So, yeah, you didn't know anything different. Yeah, so you being called boy, that's what you heard all your life. That was the way people moved and grew back. Then, you know you were less than a citizen. Yeah, you know, you were not viewed as equal, especially in the deep south, especially in south, you know. But it was.

chris: 15:43

It was weird because he from washington. So even in washington, he understood. He didn't even yell at the bus driver oh my god, let me get up and get off the bus, right. Even as a black man from the city, he understood. I'm in the south, right, come on this. How they gonna talk? Right, right, cool, right, because those things transferred over us driver. Yeah, was that disrespectful to a captain of the army officer? Yes, calling him boy, this ain't just your stop.

chris: 16:09

So he gets off and he's met by Corporal Ellis and there's white people standing outside of their shops and they're amazed to see a black man, a black captain. Yes, it kind of shocked me. I'm like damn, they're not used to seeing black men in authority like this. It looked like they'd seen a ghost, literally, because it was, he was. He was a ghost, a real life walking ghost, absolutely A nigga with bars With bars Shiny ones too. Oh no, that's not happening. Fresh and pressed and clean. They hadn't seen that before.

chris: 16:47

Davenport goes to see Colonel Nivens and Colonel Nivens basically says he don't give a fuck about what Washington said. You are not to go question no white people in the city of Tynan over a black soldier getting killed because it's going to spark a keg of fire and it's going to be explosion in town. And basically he's basically saying they're not going to let you arrest white men over black men. Exactly, that's crazy, 100%, that's fucking crazy. Throughout this whole time you're going to hear me say again and again the military is just a microcosm of the real world. That proves it right there. Look, we are not governed by the rules and the regulations of this town, of this state or whatever. We are federal military people.

chris: 17:41

However, in my experience as a white man growing up in whatever little town he asked him do you ever heard of, if you remember that, have you ever heard of whatever? And that was like, right, I ain't never heard of that. Well, he was letting you know. Well, in my part of town, sir, you kind of people, you got a place and so just don't think, let's not get it twisted. Even though you got them bars on your, your shoulders, you still got a place, you still got a place. Yeah, see, that was hard for me to watch. I ain't gonna lie, that was hard for me to watch.

chris: 18:12

Some of these parts it's like, yeah, here's a man who dedicated, who's dedicating his life to, to service of this country, and y'all treating him like he ain't shit and he got the bars, got the, he got the bars, he got the bars and, if not more educated than the colonel, he's a lawyer, he's a lawyer with bars and y'all treat him like he a fucking field negro, yep. But basically Colonel Nivens ends it with saying he just wants to keep the peace. He said he's been in Tynan for three years and he's like I like it here. Him and his wife got a nice little house and shit. She cut her little flowers and stuff, so he don't want to rock the boat and he feels like Davenport is definitely going to rock the boat. Now, davenport, he didn't come off as a person who was coming here to rock the boat, no, he just wanted to find out who did Do his job. He want to do his job, that's it. It was kind of weird. It's like y'all making this man feel like he's just coming here just tearing shit. He's not, he's just there to do an investigation and find out who killed the sergeant, that's all. Whether they're white or black, it didn't matter. That's a point too that I know we're going to cross again and again because, again, no-transcript. Despite them being subjugated, despite them being ridiculed, despite them being lynched, and they were put in all these roles of servitude, still in the United States Army that they would have been doing outside of the United States Army, doing all the cooking, the cleaning, the shucking, the jiving and all this stuff, but they, even through that, they wanted to go over, get on the front lines and defend this country and fight. So yeah, we're going to cross that point a lot. They sure did.

chris: 20:05

Davenport is being driven around by Corporal Ellis and Corporal Ellis is telling him that he's only flipped a Jeep over twice and he's laughing about that like, oh, only twice. But the interesting thing is they're driving around, none of the soldiers has ever seen a black captain too. So they're all stopping doing jumping jacks and going like, oh yes, like even the white person that was the drill person was like he never seen one, like it was crazy that they had never seen one. So davenport goes to see, uh, captain taylor, right, and soon as he walks into office, captain tay Taylor's is. His mouth was wide open, yes, because he heard Captain Davenport and he's assuming it's a white person, exactly. And when he walks in there's a black man. He's like yeah, you don't even hide, right. He just said it was my holy shit, you're black. He might as well say holy shit, right, black Right. Because that's what his facial expression showed. He couldn't even hide his reaction. It was like weird.

chris: 21:10

So Captain Taylor is pleasantly surprised and shocked that Davenport, the way Davenport speaks his stripes, and also that Davenport is a lawyer Throughout this military base. That information gets out because everybody, even the two people we'll talk about later, they all knew he was a lawyer. So it kind of you've seen, it kind of got through the base, like a black captain who's a law graduate is coming here. They kept throwing it out there, right, you're just a lawyer, you're just a lawyer. It's like no, motherfucker, you're a captain who happens to have a law degree. He's a captain first. Who are you supposed to respect? Exactly, 100%. There's a ring.

chris: 21:51

Military has rank structure, sidebar. Cut it out, but it's got to be said. Because, again, this is why I chose this movie. You know, my dad was the first flight engineer that the Marine Corps ever had for the C-130 aircraft. Ok, so similar to Captain Davinsport's story where everybody is shocked to see, you know, a black captain. Same thing with him when he once he qualified to become a flight engineer. Literally he tells the story so beautifully. This needs to be a movie.

chris: 22:25

But when his bird taxis to the end of the runway he gives off Master Nick Kuranek, master Sergeant Nick Kuranek, who was the trainer of him, comes down off the bird and says your lily white flight line is over. This man is qualified. And now he experienced many of the same things. Because now he's walking on the base and he's a black man with gold wings. He's enlisted, but he's a black man with gold wings that didn't exist, right, you know, in the Marine Corps. And so, again, it's just a parallel of why this movie just stands out to me.

chris: 22:59

You know, captain Taylor basically tells Davenport the same thing that Niven said, which was don't, don't question the white people Not trying to rock the boat. I don't know why you're here. What's weird is this I thought we're talking about the military structure, why these people didn't give a fuck about Washington told him to do this shit. They kept saying I don't give a damn what Washington told you. Are they supposed to be saying this type of shit? No, absolutely not. He's getting orders from Washington. But you see how prominent race is in what we do. Again, I was a racist before I ever put on this uniform, so I'm not going to stop being that because the United States government, my boss, is telling me not to.

chris: 23:45

Oh, the fight that our brothers and sisters, our people of color, servicemen and women, had to fight. They fought two wars simultaneously. That was crazy. Yeah, two wars. They fought the war abroad with the enemy and they fought the war right here at home, just to be respected as a person. Yeah, that goes back to that joke that Chris Rock said back in the day. He was like I ain't scared of Al-Qaeda, I'm scared of Al-Kraka. Al-qaeda never did shoot my black ass, al-kraka hung my people. That's some real shit.

chris: 24:22

So we get to a point to where I think it's a white private is walking and he passes up ellis in davenport and he's so not used to seeing a black captain. He walks past him, doesn't salute him, or nothing. Right to where he realized, oh shit, let me turn around and salute him. Then he goes, yep, and then davenport's like kind of like, yeah, motherfucker, recognize. And he gave him the brush-off salute too, yeah, recognize, don't walk past me. Like this, shit don't matter. So that was kind of dope, though, yes, because he turned around. Oh shit, great scene. That was a great scene.

chris: 25:01

The first person that Davenport interviews is Wilkie, and Wilkie used to be a sergeant, yeah, and he lost his stripes Correct, because Waters took his stripes from him, yeah, so there was the issue right there. Now, what was funny with the Wilkie interview was that he started off saying all this positive shit about Waters. He was a nice guy and all this other shit. As it went on and as the movie went on, you start seeing Waters had some little bit of evilness in him too. If you would ask Waters, he would probably tell you that it's for the right cause, but it still had a little bit of evil in it. He knew what was going to happen with the shit he was trying to do to people. He had some evil in here somewhere. But you understand. That tells you how determined and focused he was to get it done. Yes, 100%. When he wanted to get rid of Geechies he was not fucking around. He's like we're going to get rid of all you Geechies, right, and shout out to Art Evans too. Man, he played that role. Man, oh my God. And Wilkie was a great character.

chris: 26:08

Wilkie was a great character and Wilkie was a solid dude who just wanted his respect. That's it. And really he just wanted to provide for his family. That's it. He was the only one that had kids. He told him that was the ultimate motive. So I got to make this rank and serve and get the most I can to provide for my family.

chris: 26:26

It took him 10 years to get to his stripes Right, and Waters took it Right Because he was drunk one night or something like that. As much as Waters drink, you're going to take his stripes for drinking. You're going to drink every night. You walk out here pissing drunk you, you don't take his stripes. So I didn't like that at all. I'm like, okay, if you a non-drinker, I can see you feeling that way, but you get pissing drunk every night. You took this man's stripes to drink. The shit. Is this Something else? Oh my God. So as they're talking, davenport finds out through Wilkie is that Sergeant Waters did not really like Brothers from the South. He had a thing against Brothers from the South because he saw all of them as stepping fetches yes, sub balls, no sub balls, stuff like that.

chris: 27:15

And we even run into a character named CJ who was the culmination of something from slavery CJ Memphis. To hear CJ talk made my blood boil. Seeing this culmination of something from slavery CJ Memphis. Cj talk made my blood boil. Seeing this shit. Why is he talking like that? But when I started thinking, I'm like he's only one generation from slavery. His grandparents were slaves In 1944, cj's grandparents would have been slaves. So the reason why he was talking like that is because that's who he grew up around. Yes, sir Balsa, no, sir Balsa, I was a abba dabba and all that shit. And Waters did not like that shit because he knew the white race is seeing all black people like CJ. He did not like it. All black people like CJ, he did not like it.

chris: 28:04

Now, what was so evil and diabolical about Waters was that he would play so nice to CJ. He would talk all this nice shit about him, don't he play good? He's such a good boy, he's the best baseball player. He gave all this positive energy, but he hated the fuck out of CJ, the ultimate snake in the grass. Oh, my God, man, how do we think about in life, how many people are in that, even right now, yes, who are playing extreme roles, but hate your guts. Hate your guts and living. We from the West, we from the West Coast, we from California. Yeah, even quick, snippet, right, denzel's character says, when he comes to the office I'm from Hollywood, california. Yeah, you know, even a quick snippet right, denzel's character says, when he comes into office, that I'm from Hollywood, california. Right, right, right. Which is hilarious.

chris: 28:54

But we live in a demographic or geographic location where it's not overt, you know it's so subtle, yeah, you know. And to have that play into how Waters it's not overt, it's so subtle and to have that play into how Waters treated CJ like you said, just complimenting but hating his guts in the same way, in front of people giving him compliments and stuff so you thought that that was his dude. He really had love for him but he hated CJ and he hated every black person that was like CJ. He hated him, yes, and he had reasons to get into that. So this is the thing I want to get into is like this is what's so weird. Like I said, I grew up with a man, my father, that had some of those ideas that Sergeant Waters had, and I understand where he's coming from.

chris: 29:44

But you can't hurt your own people, despite what you feel about. That's why I disagree with with Waters. It's like I get it. I feel the same way. I don't want to be around no black people acting like that because they'll think I'm like that. But I'm not going to harm that man or cause harm to him because he's a step and fetch it. I'm not doing that to my own people.

chris: 30:05

Here is the ultimate enemy that we are all fighting and again, this movie just highlights it so great. Yes, racism is the background, but the ultimate thing is classes. Yes, classes, that's what we're fighting. We're fighting it on a global scale and, but the sad part is it, we fight even within our community. Yes, we do, and that's the highlight of the relationship and the hate that Waters has for CJ. Right, it's the classism, because we're trying to achieve this elite status of acceptance, because we're trying to achieve this elite status of acceptance and we will buy into that system so hard that we will harm people who don't fit that status quo. Yeah, you know, it is crazy, it is. And but for what? Because you're trying to prove that you are somehow better than someone else. You know, I never had. You know, I will.

chris: 31:10

I love to talk to people from everywhere and anywhere, you know, and if you're, if your vernacular is slang filled, I love it. Yeah, you know. And can I necessarily take you into the board meeting? Not necessarily, but I'm not going. I'm not going to hate you for talking the way you talk. I respect it because there's a place for it and I understand where you come and where you grew up, and so on and so forth, because we're all from different places. Right, right and just. I mean having. Of course, we wish more people had that. Yeah, but Waters was just the ultimate depiction of how that evil system can infiltrate us against our brother.

chris: 31:50

Yeah, now, what's weird is that I've been told several times. I mean because I talk shit just like anybody else, but when I'm at work, I'm focused Work, no cussing, don't say the N-word, don't say nothing. And I've been told by my white supervisors at different jobs Basically, you don't even act like the rest. I knew that was coming out. Yeah, oh yeah. And I don't be knowing how to take that. Because what are you trying to say? Right, right, Like, right. What are you actually trying to say? Like, because I'm at work, I'm supposed to be just because these 20 year olds run around saying nigga, nigga, nigga, nigga. Supposed to be. Just because these 20-year-olds run around saying nigga, nigga, nigga, nigga.

chris: 32:24

I'm in my 40s and 50s, I'm supposed to be running around saying the same shit. Right, I know how to differentiate work from regular talk. Right, right. And here's the term for it. You know it Code switching. That's right. Waters was the ultimate code switch. He sure was, you know, and we do it too. I noticed myself doing it. I do it all the time we do it. I do it all the time we do it. As Black men, we have to do it and you have to in order to be accepted into this society. You want that job. You better know how to cold switch. That's real.

chris: 33:00

But I do feel a sense of pride when I'm around people like myself who know how to handle themselves in business environments. But I also feel a certain way too, when the youngsters come around that I might work with at a job and they got their pants down to their knees and they draw the same. It's like, yeah, come on. Yeah, now they might think I'm like you, right, right, you know what I'm saying. So, like you know, I tell my. They might think I'm like you, right, right, you know what I'm saying. So like even I tell my son now, I pull your fucking pants when you around me, just pull you when you not around me. I know you're going to do whatever you're going to do, but around me, yeah, you got to, that's it. That's not going to have your pants around your knees around me, that shit don't fly with me. Yeah, and I get it. That's the culture. But if you really knew how. In the prison system you can never walk around with your pants around your knees because you get the R word done to you Grape Grape, right? You don't understand why having your pants down that far is not a good thing, right?

chris: 33:58

But anyway, wilkie tells Davenport that the whole base was talking about the Klan had something to do with it. But Wilkie says something interesting. That was a pivotal point. He said the Klan would normally take the stripes off of black soldiers because they don't respect them. And Waters stripes were still on his uniform. So that made me think like, oh shit, you know what I'm saying. Situation, and even, and even Davenport had to step back and go. Oh yeah, ok, message. That's a good, that's a good indication it might not be the clan. You know what I'm saying so.

chris: 34:39

So next Peterson is interviewed. You know he tells a story about the game where CJ won with the home run and everything. It was funny watching that game where CJ hit the home run. All the white people were like they was done. They were so mad when they lost that game they were salty. Yeah, they were salty over that shit. Cj wasn't in there, they was mad. But I'm like damn y'all gonna walk out of the game because of my home run. Y'all that racist. She was funny as fuck. He took the wind out of his sails, oh my God Again. That's why I do love the character of the white lieutenant. Why am I blanking Taylor? Taylor, thank you. Because Taylor was just as excited as all of the rest of the black folks. But his cold heart was like who the fuck are you clapping for? What are you doing? But Taylor was like no, he played ball. That's what I see. I see a ball player. These are my dudes, black or not, these are my dudes. That whole run was for my dudes.

chris: 35:46

Yep, it was kind of weird seeing that Taylor wasn't really overt in his whether he was racist or not. You never really saw that from him. I think that was the beauty of his character, because he wasn't. He just wasn't. We would refer to him as a white ally, right, he's correct. Yeah, he's the John Brown. He is the one that literally can. Well, we use that. I don't agree. But for the sake of this, I don't see color, I'm seeing. You know, right, he would be the one that would always say I don't see color. Yeah, I'm not stopping at your color as a definition. I want what you do is what you do. You play ball, you, you ballplayer. I respect that. You respect you a lawyer, you in this army, you a captain. I respect that and I'm a show it to you. So, yeah, I'm so glad that they had his character to be that bridge, you know, because I was kind of confused on Nivens Like Nivens are racist, right, oh, was Nivens more or less like not trying to rock the boat.

chris: 36:41

I couldn't tell whether Nivens it was hard Liked black people or didn't like black people. It was hard, but you could tell. With Taylor, though, taylor was like nah, a soldier is a soldier. I'm not even tripping off the color. Even after the game he was like y'all got the day off. He didn't have to do that. No, he didn't, but he respected dudes that did what they were supposed to do. So he let them drink their beer and say y'all have a day off, and even in the sense of again, that was another pivotal scene where Waters code switching, playing, playing the part, and he says well, sir, I don't think a colored in CO should be in the mix of some officers. And he says who gave that order? Colonel? Whoever? He says well, I'll go talk to him. These men have the day off, see, because he respected the people. Yeah, you know, and Waters had to, you know, be the, the, the super Negro. Yeah, you know, the super servant to to satisfy the higher class so that he didn't look bad. And, yeah, it gets deep.

chris: 37:44

It's kind of going along the narrative of what people say now in the music industry, with Black artists saying about the Oscars and the Grammys and stuff. They're saying why are we worried about being accepted by them when they don't want to accept us? We got our own shit. We might have got some ratchet shit, but at least it's ours. We get to choose what black music goes into that.

chris: 38:07

And it's weird because in this particular movie, the only thing Waters is trying to do is please Massa. The whole fucking movie. You hate CJ, but you're doing the exact same thing. You're trying to please Massa. Cj's doing the same fucking thing and you don't even see it. Yes, again, that's why this movie is so. That's why this movie is so brilliant because, if you look at, it highlights all of this. It brings it to the forefront. Yes, he's trying to, he's always trying to show off for the white people, which he claims that's why he hates guys like cj and from the south. But you're doing the same shit. You just doing it in a polite way and educated bug man, yeah, just educated, but y'all still doing the same exact thing. So that was kind of weird too, and I started processing that it was going on. It was like you ain't nothing but educated, cj, you just know how to talk, that's it. That's it. That's it, that's it. That's the only difference. You dancing exactly the same as CJ. Yep, so Taylor gives the guys a day off after the win.

chris: 39:10

Waters comes in and basically says no, y'all going to paint the officers club. The soldiers is like man, why we got to do that shit, why they can't paint their own club. So that becomes a big thing. Right, anything you don't want to do, the color troops will do for you. That was dope. That was dope. That pissed Waters up. Shut it up. Oh yeah, shut it up. He shut it down.

chris: 39:36

So Denzel's character, peterson no, peterson wasn't no punk. He said man, we ain't doing that shit. And he gets into a Waters and basically Waters man, we ain't doing that shit. And he gets into a Waters and basically Waters says we gonna fight. We got an uppity Negro and we gonna fight. And the soldiers are trying to talk Peterson out of it because they know Waters is dirty. Right, they know Peterson is way bigger than Waters, but they kind of understand he ain't gonna fight fair. You going out for a fair fight, he going to do some dirty shit. And that's exactly what Waters did, 100%. I ain't mad at Waters, for that Ain't no such thing as a fair fight. You got to win, we going to win, by any means necessary. Yeah, let me throw this in because I don't want to lose it. I hope I'm not jumping.

chris: 40:23

But when you look at the characters of Waters and Peterson, right, just as you highlighted how Waters was the same as CJ, peterson is the same as Waters. Yes, yes, they're diametrically opposed. Yes, they both want the best for the race. Yes, they both want the best for the race. However, waters, in his evil way of playing, will kill for it. We'll kill for it. So will Peterson. So he did. That's deep. I like that. They're all the same people. They all want the same endgame, but they're going about it. They're all the same. They all want the same end game, but they're going about it the wrong way of getting there Because technically, cj ain't bothering nobody.

chris: 41:11

There was no reason for y'all to do that type of shit to CJ. Yes, he's a step and fetching. Yes, he sounds like a slave from the 1800s but he's not bothering nobody. So they had no right. Sergeant Waters had no right to do that shit to that man and Wilkie understood that later on it fucked with Wilkie because they knew what that boy did. But Sergeant Waters and Peterson have the fight and for the most part it starts off a fair fight Punch here, punch there. But then Peterson knocks Waters down. Waters start talking shit on his knees and throws some sand in his face which he got to do and knocks Peterson the fuck out, lays him out on his back and he was about to hit him again and another sergeant, equal rank, said that's enough, that's enough.

chris: 41:59

Which let me know that there was respect amongst the colored sergeants for each other. Yeah, one sergeant said he stopped, they had to stick together. Yeah, and it was respected. Yeah, you know. Again, it's just the dichotomy of it all. Like Peters and Watterson, you could parallel to others, malcolm and Martin.

chris: 42:23

There was a respect because even later on W goes on to say or Wilkie told Wilkie said he respected Peterson. He was even going to promote him because Peterson stood on stood on business, as they say these days and and was. You know, we have different ideologies but if you, if you stand in that heart for yours, that you willing to throw hands for it, and I'm standing and you're gonna battle me, I can't do nothing but respect you. He had respect for peterson. I wish we could have. We could have at some point in the movie or they would have been a director's cut of showing of a conversation between wilkie yeah, waters, where he actually said it. It would have been nice to hear him say yeah, I really respect that dude. He the only one of them punk ass motherfuckers that actually wanted to fight me. You know what I'm saying. That would have been nice for him to hear him say that shit. But it was good that we finally did find out that he actually did respect Peterson. He respected him.

chris: 43:15

And even Peterson said after that fight, he left me alone, which tells you that the issue wasn't really Peterson, the issue was CJ. Yeah, it was never Peterson, right, because he said Waters left me alone after that fight. Yep, left me alone and it was, but the issue was Waters disdained for CJ. Yeah, he all my guy. Yeah, because CJ was a good guy. Cj was a good guy. He was a good guy. You know that's the kind of dude you want right next to you because you know he looking out for you, he going to give you his last, and he's genuine and authentic. That's the dude I want to roll with over Watterson, who you talked about earlier, who going to smile in my face and hate me behind my back. No, sir, I think when Watterson's seen and heard, every time he heard CJ talk he felt like we went backwards in time. I think that's what really pissed Waters off. Like seeing CJ always playing the guitar and yes, no so, and really saying speaking in that manner was like, dude, you're trying to take us back to slavery. There's no way they're going to respect us when we got Geechies like you around, right? So Waters is like I'm getting rid of all these motherfuckers. I'm going to take over the world. Pinky, he was like I'm getting rid of all y'all Keechies.

chris: 44:32

So Davenport finally shows up to his sleeping quarters and he's supposed to. He's a captain. The quarter's supposed to have like a hundred captains in there. That, motherfucker, was empty, empty. Them white captains were like we are not sleeping around, no black man. And it was empty. Empty. Them white captains were like we are not sleeping around, no black man. And it was empty. Even Davenport walked in and was like no y'all, motherfuckers didn't. The look on his face was like no, y'all didn't. And it was empty and subpar. Because he's an officer, his billet is supposed to be a little bit more nicer. You know, that's the separation between the dirty sex. That nicer, that's the separation between the dirty sex. That's the separation between enlisted and officers and serving in the military. I know officers are quarters. They always had nicer stuff. That's the way it's supposed to be. That's what it breeds For him to be a captain and have subpar living situations.

chris: 45:20

Another big point of the movie Just seeing Davenport walking in and going no y'all didn't like, no, y'all didn't. Give me this bullshit and I'm here by myself. It's hot as fucking. He got a little ass. It's this the summertime 1944. It's the south, yes, probably 100 degrees at night. He got a little ass man. That's all he got is a little ass fan. Oh God, from the Southern Heat, yep. So he goes into the bathroom. He's looking in the bathroom. It's dirty as fuck and he looks in the mirror and it says, welcome, snowflake, yep. And it's like they just not respecting him At all. So let me ask you this In the military, would somebody get away with being that blatantly racist against somebody?

chris: 46:07

Not today, not today, but in his time. It's again. It's accepted. That's what's going on. It for military. You're all supposed to be on a level playing field. You all ain't shit. That's what they tell you when you, as soon as you get off that bus, right, you ain't shit. All of you are maggots at this point. God damn, okay, and that's our name for months Maggots, woo, okay.

chris: 46:33

So again, don't matter what race, color, creed, you are, blah, blah, blah. Because why, in order for any military service to move, we have to have equality Correct, nobody can be more special than the next in order for us to move into a certain vein. But again, at that time, that existed because again, it was just what society is. There's no reason why, on a military base, you should have a separated color and white only section. You should have a separated color and white only section. Because, again, we getting paid the same, our ranks say the same, our uniforms are the same. There's nothing individual about us. That's what I'm trying to say. In the military, you are brought to be one. So if you or me are replaced, the wheel keeps on turning. There's no cogs missing, the gear is going to keep going. But if we take that and highlight this in this time of again, I don't care what you achieve, you are still beneath me. That's not how our service is supposed to move. Plain and simple. Right, you know, man, that was long. I tried. I was trying to get it out. I'm glad you explained it. Oakland Public Schools I'll be trying to. What you trying to say about our schools? No, you good, you showed up for class. Shout out to OSD, oakland School District.

chris: 48:01

But there was a point in the movie where it said colored officers building, right. And that shocked me too, because I'm like, I thought all officers, because remember when davenport first got there, there was a white guy and a black guy at the very beginning. Yes, they seemed like they were the same and everything was good, right. But then I saw the building that said colored officers only, and we saw later on they had a white officers only and they had a pool table and all type of shit in there. Nice building.

chris: 48:30

Separate and unequal, separate and unequal, but y'all fighting the same fight, same fight. But again one more time before military is a microcosm of true society. That's what was existed at that time, where we had separate facilities. They brought it onto the military installation where it has no place. It has no place. There should not be a white and all. We are all serving under this uniform. We all signed the contract. We are all willing to sacrifice any and everything up to our lives. So there is no separation of white and black, right, but no. But during that time there very much was, and it's sad. That is very sad.

chris: 49:15

Davenport eventually has an argument with Taylor, with Captain Taylor, about the two white officers who saw Waters last in and weren't. He interviewed him, but he didn't really interview him. So Davenport was kind of like why you didn't put this in a report and tell you know? Because he found out through Ellis. Ellis told him like it was two white guys that saw Waters that night. So Davenport finds out because Taylor, taylor's an open book. Taylor's like well, colonel Nivens told me, colonel Nivens, he followed orders To put that shit, you know, under wraps. So it goes back to Nivens, which goes back to what I was saying, like I couldn't figure out whether Nivens wanted this shit to get solved or he didn't.

chris: 49:58

Was he a racist, wasn't he? Yep, they kept that really, that gray line, yeah, that real gray line. It was super gray Because he never used the word nigga, right? No, he never said nigga and Taylor didn't either. So it wasn't like they were overt with it, as like one of the white officers who actually said nigga to the captain to his damn face, right. I think that's a little bit of the testimony and I know it sounds conflicting, but yes, they never did that.

chris: 50:26

Because you can't, you should not be a colonel, a high serving rank in the military and make that distinction. If you stand for the values of what the service is, because it's always a battle you were who you were before you came in, but you've been indoctrinated into this new realm of service where we are literally are the constitution. All men are created equal. So I cannot be in this top serving rank and disrespect you as if you are not my equal. As you're saying.

chris: 51:00

One of them, if not both, could have been a real racist, but in their positions they were not. They had to let it go, supposed to be saying because you can't, you can't, you can't, I can't go into the military, you know, talking about black power, black lives matter and so forth, and have the next, my counterpart saying you know, kkk, all lives matter, all that, and us serve together, we can. The only way we can serve together is if we eliminate all of that. Got you One common goal, one common goal, one dream, one mission. That's why we drill in the military. We drill and drill and drill and drill, because it's teaching us to move together in an organized fashion to get to the same place at the same time Nice. So that's what has to be represented. So that's why you never knew. If Colonel Nivens was that way, and even if he was, he sacrificed it in order to serve his country, his billet, because they never used the N-word at all. Yeah, they never used the N-word at all, but they were little hints that he might feel a certain type of black. Right, not Taylor. Yeah, taylor was, yeah, but it just that's what. Hey, that's where we are.

chris: 52:14

So we get to where Taylor tells Davenport about the two white officers and what happened that night and that they left him on the road. Davenport is really mad because that kind of just got swept up under the rug. The two white officers saw him find out that they beat him up. You know, they beat him up. They did leave him alive, right. However, did he outrank them, didn't Waters? No, no, no, because Waters was enlisted.

chris: 52:41

Gotcha, ok, ok, that's why I was confused. I thought Waters were over there, so he was not. He was not over there. So he was not, he was not over there. Okay, okay, okay, cause I'm like why are they talking? Yeah, in the military you have to, so you have officers and you have enlisted, uh, and so officers, always, even if you're the highest enlisted, the lowest officer is still over you. Oh see, I didn't know that. Yeah, yeah, that's why they?

chris: 53:11

Because that one white guy, he was fucking pissed at waters, like you have this nigga talking to me, and the other white guy was cool, he's like man, just he drunk, just let him. You know he, everybody kind of knows who waters is on the base. So that one white guy, the cool one, was like just let him be. And he like, nah, this nigga gonna learn right, he gonna learn tonight. Yeah, because again he just he had it in, like he gonna learn how to, because again he had it in. He gonna learn how to talk to a white person Because outside these gates that's how we roll, that's how they rolled outside. It ain't got nothing to do with this ring.

chris: 53:38

This particular night, waters was so pissy drunk, just the truth was coming out of him. Like they say, the truth will always come out of kids and drunk folks. That's it. That's it. Kids and drunk Tell no lies. They tell no lies.

chris: 53:54

And Walter said what the hell he had to say and what he ended up saying. I ain't doing nothing. No, white person, tell me to do no more. What you do is not having that shit. Oh no, not in my part of town. You're going to do everything. Yeah, he was like, no fuck, I'm about to fuck his ass up. I think he punched him a couple of times, kicked him, kicked him down. Then the other white guy kind of got him away. But they did leave him alive, correct. But to Davenport's surprise, they showed like the white officers when he surprise, they showed like the white officers when he interviewed. They showed no remorse for this man being dead. They were just like oh well, you know, there's another nigga dead. Business is you Business? Is you which lets you know, maybe they, before they enlisted, they were part of the KKK, I mean, or you know, or even if they weren't that extreme, it was just a sign of the times. Yeah, you know that's.

chris: 54:52

This is a little bit tangent, but that's. That's what the problem that we have in this country, even still today, that it just keeps repeating it's. It's not that every white, white person is racist. They're not. They're not Right. However, they are just complicit to the times. Right, you know it's. It don't affect me, or I'm not doing it. I'm not the one perpetrating the, the, the injustices. So the physical harm, right, all that stuff. I'm not out there shooting people or hanging people or whatever. That's not me, and so as long as it's not me, then I don't see the problem. Them, and they left them alive.

chris: 55:37

Uh, they showed a part where uh waters was crying as he was getting beat by him and he said he hated himself. Yes, so I think that was deep to me because, like, even in within himself, he knew that what he was doing was wrong. The shit he was doing to cj and the shit that we found out later he did to other people, it was. He knew it was wrong. Yeah, yeah, but he couldn't get away from it. He was too deep from his own evilness, he's like, but I got to get it done. Yeah, that's why the drinking yeah, he's like I hate myself. Yeah, and just keep going back to Adolph's season man, that performance, yeah, something crying. Right, you would swear he's looking at a drunk person who was admitting guilt. I've seen people look like that before. He embodied it 100%.

chris: 56:37

So Davenport goes to Colonel Niven's home, which he has a lovely home, nice wife, and he basically says he wants to interview and possibly, if they're guilty, arrest the white officers. And Niven's like you can't, you a black, you a black man, you're not arresting two white officers, whether they're guilty or not, which is weird, like whether they're guilty or not, he can't arrest them. So basically, davenport, kind of lightweight, threatens to say well, you know, I'll just send it back to Washington that you told me blah, blah, blah. He was like hold on, hold on, right, you can interview him. Right, you can interview him. As long as there's another white officer around when you interview him, come on. Which would be Captain Taylor with him.

chris: 57:26

So Davenport leaves out of house. He does a little skip dance out of house, yes. So Davenport leaves out of house. He does a little skip dance out of house and then the wife looks at him like no, you ain't skipping Right, right, yeah, straight up. I'm still a black man in the South, but he was able to. He got permission to just interview them, even if they admitted to killing them. You can't arrest, right, only interview. You can't do your job. But, yeah, just do your job.

chris: 57:54

Davenport goes from there. He doesn't go straight to interview him, he goes to interview Henson and he finds out that Waters set up CJ with the gun. Right, uh, that was basically set up with, uh, wilkie, wilkie, yeah, he climbed in there and put it under the bunk, right, yeah, and uh, back then in the south, that was a long. That wasn't like no, you're gonna be in a hole. For two weeks people got shot over that gun set up. He was going to be in jail for a long fucking time.

chris: 58:33

Cj was a farm boy, they said, meaning wildlife. He used to open space. As evil as Waters was. He knew that would kill him mentally, taking a dude who had freedom his whole life, farms and everything, sitting on acres on a farm back in the day, putting them in a six by six. Six by six. He knew it would kill him One way or another. It would kill him, you know.

chris: 58:59

So Waters had Wilkie plant the gun by CJ's bunk, by his bed, knowing that CJ don't even like guns. He even said he's like I don't even like guns. He even seen it. He was like I don't even like it. You know I don't like guns. Why would I shoot and then put the gun next to my damn bed like, right, waters didn't give a fuck.

chris: 59:18

The, the fix was in. He's like nah, motherfucker you side note, cj was in the wrong job if he didn't like guns. But you know, cj, he's the wrong guy. Everybody. It was funny. It wasn't funny, but it was weird seeing that everybody Peterson was the only one was like y'all don't see this shit. He been set up. You don't see that it was Waters who did this shit to him. They all like, well, it could have been anybody. Well, maybe it wasn't. Maybe Peterson. Like y'all don't see the setup. The writing is on the wall. Yeah, he like. He started putting on his clothes and he was like I'm gonna go talk to the officers now and let them know that CJ was in here all night long. Everybody in the barracks was like CJ was there all night long. That was crazy.

chris: 1:00:10

It's hard to go up against the establishment and the military now doubled down on that. There's a charge, the Uniform Code of Military Justice, that conduct unbecoming. I've heard that before If you ever watched the one with Tom Cruise, a few good men or whatever you know. And the very last part of Cobra Dawson says you know, still supposed to go and protect him. But it's a hard line to toe when again, look at Wilkie, wilkie's the sacrificial lamb, right, yeah, he lost everything he had by someone of that structure who knocked him down. Well, think about the other guys. Well, shit, if he did it. I'm not fitting the rock to both and and and, even though I know he's wrong. Yeah, yeah, even if I know he's wrong. I mean, again, on on the plantation, what did they do? They took the strongest one out, beat him, didn't rise up, right? That's parallel to that situation in that scene.

chris: 1:01:29

God damn, because we talk about the tragedy that happened to CJ and we'll get to that, and then even the tragedy that happened to Waters, which we've already talked about. Wilkie was fucking collateral damage. He went to jail for this shit. He went to jail and all he was doing was following orders. He liked. Cj Literally liked him and never wanted to call CJ home. He followed Waters' orders and he ends up going to jail. Man, I was mad when I seen that part. It's a cold world Arrest, wilkie. Wilkie was following orders, right, but it was Wilkie's duty to protect CJ. To protect CJ, correct, I'm glad you. It was Wilkie's duty to protect CJ, to protect CJ, correct you are. I'm glad you cleared that up.

chris: 1:02:14

So Davenport interviews Cobb, which is David Allen Greer's character, and find out that they were best friends they were really good friends and Cobb tells Davenport that CJ went crazy in, went crazy in jail. He started talking to himself. It drove him crazy. A farm boy is not used to being six by six. Even CJ said I can't even see the sun, no more, damn. I try to sing the word that don't come out. Nothing comes out. Cj, you're talking crazy. See, that's the other bad part of this movie. I can quote and do everybody. I can quote and do everybody. You're talking crazy. Cj eventually kills himself, commits suicide.

chris: 1:03:01

All the black soldiers in protest throw the last baseball game. Had they won that game they could have played the New York Yankees, but that's how serious that shit was. Could have played the New York Yankees, but that's how serious that shit was. Fuck the Yankees. We're not going to win a game for Waters and Taylor when y'all allow this to happen to CJ, knowing that he never had the damn good. You know what I'm saying. They threw it.

chris: 1:03:24

I guess CJ told Cobb when Waters came to see him the conversation they had and that was one of the deepest conversations in the entire fucking movie. It was pivotal. He explained exactly why he did what he did to CJ. It all came to head. Yeah, he said I grew up with dudes like you from the South, yeah, Dancing around, making white people feel good, singing, showing your teeth, dancing, singing. Yes, I grew up with dudes like you from the South Dancing around, making white people feel good, showing your teeth singing. Yes, a bossing, yes, a bossing. And he was like I was on. I want to say he said three different bases. He's like I got rid of two over here, two Geechies over here, one over here, three over here. He said now, I got you. I I was like that was evil. Yeah, that was pure evil. Yes, he said now I got you. And that's when cj. You look at cj's eyes, he was like I'm fucked, I'm done, I'm done. Even cj, the country ass boy, cj understood, right, he was done. Yeah, when the sergeant said, now I got you. You know what I'm saying.

chris: 1:04:32

You got to understand why Waters felt the way he felt. He seriously felt like guys from the South that were like CJ, set the race back, set it back. And we got to give Waters a little bit of credit too and I'm glad they highlighted how did he get this way in his first place? But he always talked about his dad, his dad. He said my daddy shoved a coal from the back of a truck his whole life. He couldn't read it right but made sure we didn't. But he said we had to get rid of people like CJ. He said don't say here, or don't say huh, say here, say you know all these things that he was here.

chris: 1:05:10

He was groomed because his dad thought that same way he did, that the white establishment, the classism, what he was supposed to reach, had to look this way. Yeah, to be accepted, to be accepted and respected as a black man, you had to move this way. And he always he felt like dudes, like CJ, just threw us backwards with the yesa, nosa. You're always singing and dancing and stuff like that. But in actuality guys like CJ just want to be happy. They don't really want to bother nobody. They're not trying to impress nobody. Cj was authentically him. He was just him. He was a country boy from the farm, that's it. He couldn't really help that. He talked that way. That's what he knew. That's that's all he knew. I said his brother was probably slave. Right, they were. Yeah, they were. They were slaves. So his mentality, yes, he could have been a slave mentality, but what can he do about it? That's who raised him. You're from, you're from where you're from. That's the environment.

chris: 1:06:06

But it was that scene where Waters was talking to CJ. It was just such a dope scene, even cinematically, how they shot the facial expressions and stuff. You could just see the hatred that Sergeant Waters had for CJ. He hated that boy. And the other part of the dialogue that fueled it Remember, because he told CJ about the Cafe Napoleon. He told him about the Cafe Napoleon, the monkey scene. But he didn't tell him all that part. But he just said, yeah, I used to listen to good music outside in France at the Cafe Napoleon. But then when he told CJ the real story, he said yeah, they paid one of us to put a tail on his back and eat bananas in front of all them white girls and called him king of the monkeys, and that that enraged Waters so bad, that was deep. It was deep.

chris: 1:07:00

And he said, and Waters also said we killed him. Yeah, he said do you know? Or unalived him this right, that was another deep part about. He said do you know, right before we slit that fool's throat he had, he asked us what did he do wrong? I said god. I said waters, ain't no fucking joke. You going. If you making the black race look wrong in any way, he's killing. You got to go. He's not you. You got to go. He's not playing around at all. His assignment is his assignment and whether it came from his teaching from his dad or whether it's something he learned as he got older, his assignment was his assignment Get rid of all Geechies, eradicate them and get them out of there, because they were bad for the black race and they were hurting. Uh, the black race moving forward, yep, moving forward. Uh, that was deep.

chris: 1:07:55

That scene was deep. That scene was deep, deep, deep. I want to say the last. No, it was close to the last, because he said the last thing. He said now I got you. But before he said that, he said one less fool for the race to be ashamed of. Yeah, god damn, yeah. And I think that's when they show CJ's face like, oh fuck, yeah, right, he's not letting me out of jail. Yeah, this man got me, he got me, I let him put me in here because he hit him. Yeah, he set him up, which got him there, mm-hmm. But that's when he can finally realize. But that scene was so, so important because you just saw the hatred. Yeah, you saw all the years of hatred, going back to when sergeant water was the kid. Yeah, the stuff, all of it. Yeah, it was the culmination of everything. It's like he really hates black people that are like cj not like peterson, right, but cj, specifically guys from the south, yep.

chris: 1:08:49

So davenport goes into the I guess the captain's quarters, was it? No, the, uh, the officer's quarters, the white officers, oh, to question them. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that was the officer's club, yeah, officer's club. So davenport goes into the officer's club to interview the white officers and immediately one of them in particular shows him no respect. He's just giggling and laughing and just looking at him like, right, you're a minstrel show, yeah, it's like You're here for my entertainment, at best. You know. He even says, like what is this nigga? I ain't got to answer no shit. This nigga got to say I don't respect you. He's talking to him like this yes, yeah, and Taylor really can't do anything about the language part of it, not the language but Taylor did step up, though.

chris: 1:09:32

Taylor did step up. He said, oh, you'll answer him, bernie, basically saying you call him a bunch of niggas, but you're going to answer his questions, that's it. I'm going to stick it to your ass every chance I get. Pause, pause. That's what he said. Pause, pause, that's what he said. Right, but yeah, he used, you know, this white guy was calling him a nigga to his face, and credit to Davenport. He didn't flinch, he didn't let that piss him off. He didn't move, he did not move.

chris: 1:10:03

Wow, how powerful is that, woo, how powerful is that? That of the think about the real life situations that our brothers and sisters have overcome? Doing it just like that? Yeah, I can't. I like Jackie Robinson, all that bullshit, I can't break character. Yes, davenport did not break character, because even when Captain Taylor was, like you know, stepping in and Davenport was like Taylor, I got this, I got it, I got it, yeah, ain't nothing he can say that's going to move me out of my square, stay out of what I'm trying to do. And Taylor was like, well, handle it Right. Right, because I want to. But, yeah, well, handle it Right.

chris: 1:10:50

And it was so disrespectful because, again, that guy, he was a lieutenant, so he was a lower rank than Davenport and did not respect him at all and didn't at one bit. Because when Davenport said sit down, he was like nah, he was like sit down. And then dude just started smiling like oh, yes, sir, like sarcastically, sarcastically, yes, sir, yeah, because he knew he can get away with it. I feel like he only sat down because Taylor was right, that's the only reason I come with him. He would have been like I'm not sitting down, fuck what you talk about. Yeah, they'd have beat him up and left him on the side of the road, his ass right there. Taylor was the only.

chris: 1:11:16

So that takes you back to. Maybe Nivens kind of knew that I better send another white officer with him, that's it. They might kill his black ass. Right, that's it. They might kill his black ass. Right, right, yeah, colonel never knew what time it was. Maybe this wasn't such a bad guy. Right, he said I can't have two on my watch, but he finds out. Um, because davenport is really getting in, getting getting on him about. Weren't you there and you know, really investigating really tough, and to where the white guy was like. Let me tell you something Nobody was issued 45 ammo, 45 millimeter ammo. So if he got shot with that, it wouldn't have been us, and that's what made that. The light bulb went off like it wasn't these two. He knew, right then, and there, it was not. These two Going against Captain Teller was like arrest these two motherfuckers, see, and there it was not.

chris: 1:12:10

These two. Going against Captain Taylor was like arrest these two motherfuckers. It's a credit to Captain Davenport of how thorough he is in doing his job. That's it. He was about the evidence, not the racism. Nothing matters.

chris: 1:12:25

I want the correct person Correct, because he sure could have railroaded them dudes, and Taylor would have backed him. Taylor was like I got matters. I want the correct person Correct, because he sure could have railroaded them dudes. Oh yeah, you know, and Taylor would have backed him. Taylor was like I got your back.

chris: 1:12:33

Yes, look at these two racist motherfuckers. They just said they ran into and they beat them, arrest them, he's like. But that's not what. The evidence is not showing that they killed this man, that's right. He clearly just said they didn't have the ammo that we found in this man's body, so it had to be somebody who was issued the ammo. And that was the turning point to where it was. Like. That's when, even when I first saw it, I was like, oh, it wasn't a white person who killed him. Right, tell, tell, definitely not a white person who killed him, which was the perfect cover for a black person, because it was so racially charged that if I did it as a black person, there's no way that we'd be doing right, perfect alibi, perfect alibi. I'm not. And the Klan is running all through Louisiana. Legend motherfuckers, yeah, I'm not KKK.

chris: 1:13:22

And another dope shot was when Taylor, in Davenport, was on top of the bridge, yes, yes, watching the one white guy and the two black boys play as kids do. They don't see racism, they just playing as kids. Symbolism, yeah, symbolism, it's true. But Davenport, as he's talking to Taylor, taylor says something that's really that shows you the mind of the white people. Back then he says something like when Taylor, when Davenport brought up, like he started thinking it might not be KKK and it could be somebody else.

chris: 1:13:58

Taylor says something to the fact of black people ain't that diabolical? Yes, yes, yes, he did. Black people don't think they're not evil. Jesus is like they wouldn't kill their own kind to make it look like a white person did it, like he didn't even think it's a white person that a black person would do that to another black person. Right, right. I was like that's important.

chris: 1:14:20

It was dope. Yeah, that was dope, because that shows that even white people was believing that it had to be a white person who did it. Yep, they all were drinking the same kool-Aid. Oh my God, that was such a dope little part. It was a really small part, but it just showed you to find how serious racism was.

chris: 1:14:38

Back then, when a black person died, it automatically went to a white person. Did it Right? Had to, had to. Because I'm glad you pointed that out even up until now when you said that, because a lot of times when I watched and I heard him say that, I thought it was an insult that we weren't smart enough to do that. I got you, I got you, you know. But truthfully said, yeah, no, they're not that diabolical. Not that diabolical Because it takes a diabolical person to be like I'm going to do this and make it look like this. Right, even in that small scene, he described Waters. Yes, he was describing Waters, but that's Waters.

chris: 1:15:21

Diabolicalness, if that's a word came from all those years of being cultured, nurtured by his father and then growing up, where he grew up, to make him feel that way. It wasn't like he just woke up and said I hate true country, true, yeah, that came from a long time. That hatred just was brewing and brewing and as he got up in ranks he had enough power to lock up quote-unquote Geechies and set them up like he set up CJ. But it was very diabolical what Waters was doing. And Waters could have kept doing that for infinity. Oh yeah, oh yeah, oh yeah. He could have just went to all the other bases and did the same shit. He could have just kept doing it. He could have retired out of the military and still showing up Like, uh, you got any niggas here to like us? Right, like he was diabolical. That's just a great word for Waters. He was a diabolical thinker and it was against his own people. And it's weird because it's like okay, we can all admit 1944. Waters could even admit 1944 if you asked him.

chris: 1:16:19

Do you think these white people here hate you? Yes, they do. You don't even have the same hatred for them. What the fuck? You stab an infection for them and you hate your people more than you hate the people who actually hate you. That is crazy. There's a saying for that. Everybody that's our Was it skin folk. Ain't our kin folk, ain't our kin folk, goddamn right.

chris: 1:16:48

Wilkie gets re-interviewed by Davenport because Davenport knows something is wrong. This shit don't smell, right? He knows now that them two white dudes did not kill him and he knows from the interviews that Waters pissed off a lot of black soldiers. Now we need to stop looking at white and look at these black people. He's fucking pissed off Stripes from people, beating them up, throwing sand at them. He did some diabolical shit to his own people. So let me start, let me go back and re-interview. So he re-interviews Wilkie and Wilkie finally breaks down and admits to planting the gun per Sergeant Waters orders on CJ and explains the whole feeling Sergeant Waters had for CJ and explains the whole feeling Sergeant Waters had for guys like CJ. He hated black men from the South. He thought they were all stepping fetches, geeks, and they were setting the race back. So now this is like the second or third time Davenport had heard this, so he knows what kind of person Waters is, who Waters is to heart, he knows exactly. Now he's hearing from his right hand man, right, exactly how he feels.

chris: 1:17:56

And this part is where he tells a story because he told that monkey story to Wilkie, right? So, ok, ok, ok, yeah, that's great, it was just a little bit out of work. But yeah, the story was told to Wilkie when Wilkie was him and Wilkie was in a bar and it was looking at CJ in the mirror at the bar. He told the monkey story in France about slitting the guy's throat and stuff like that, and that was just, that was crazy. That was a hell of a story. Yeah, that was a hell of a story, honestly. But it almost humanizes Waters to me, it almost humanizes him because I could see myself react in the same way. You're right, yeah, I mean honestly, even though this guy is someone that you hate through the whole movie, that kind of that excerpt.

chris: 1:18:50

It's like, huh, damn, I might have did the same thing, because why did this this, I'm going to say, fool, take it upon himself. He wasn't thinking. What is it going to do to us? How are you going to go and perform for these folks like that and shame our name? You For what? For a couple dollars. You, you know, put a our name, yeah, for what? For a couple dollars, yeah, you know. Put a tail on, yeah, and eating bananas, yeah, and shaming us like this. So we, coming for you, we gonna do something. You know, do I got to slit your throat? I don't know. That man said we slit your throat, yeah, but you, finna, get some business because we can't do that, yeah, just, we can't go to that extreme, yeah. So, yeah, I just, that was deep, that was deep.

chris: 1:19:37

But Wilkie pretty much admits everything. His part in it, waters they set him up. He explains the whole because he was with Waters the most Right, so he knows exactly who Waters is. So he explains some of that hatred, going back to the monkey part and stuff like that. So now we get to the scene where Smalls, you know, tries to run away but gets caught.

chris: 1:19:59

Now what the fuck do you think Smalls is actually trying to do? What do you think he was? Did he think he was actually going to get away? In your opinion, what do you think Smalls actually thought he was going to do? Oh, no, man, because I'm looking at like ain't another part of the hill, you could go out Something you know, brother, come on, what the fuck? Come on. What if he'd actually caught the train? You don't think they'd still look for your ass for a murder, right, sergeant? They'd still come to get you. Yeah, he was. But a fear they be waiting for the next stop with a train going. You're not getting away, yeah, that's why, when I looked at that scene, I'm like what does he think he's escaping to?

chris: 1:20:41

He had to make a run for it. You murdered somebody. He had to make a run for it. He tried. Yeah, he tried because he felt that guilt too. Oh, yeah, that ate him up, because in a way, you feel bad for him because he was collateral damage. He was. He was collateral damage he was. He also had conduct unbecoming. He at all means was supposed to stop.

chris: 1:21:06

Peterson, yes, going back to what you said, you have to protect your said. You're supposed to protect your fellow man. You have to protect him. And he didn't do it. He didn't do it, but he didn't do it. He was scared. He was scared, yeah, I mean, he was scared of Pete. Hey, young Denzel's a medicine-looking motherfucker. He had a skull and all that shit. He saw him come from the shoulders one time. He tried to fight Sarge I ain't about to go up against this nigga and he even told him. He even told Smalls he's like shut up, right, he hopped too. He was scared. He even admitted it to Davenport. I was scared, sir. I was scared. You still going to jail, oh yeah, yeah, that'll excuse you. You'll excuse that. You still going to jail? Oh yeah, that'll excuse you. You don't excuse nothing, you accessory homie. I understand you were scared, but your ass still going to jail.

chris: 1:21:56

My brother, you watched him do this and didn't do nothing about it. Matter of fact, y'all covered it up and didn't say nothing about it. Yeah, that's the cool part. You could have stitched on them later. Right, you didn't say nothing, nothing as soon as we got back. Uh, excuse me, thank you, I got something, something to tell you. You just let it go under the rug to where they was blamed. They blamed the KKK for this shit, yeah, yep. So yeah, smalls gets caught, um, and tells Davenport everything that Peterson, him and Peterson did, which was basically, they just happened to run across waters that night. It wasn't premeditated, it wasn't premeditated.

chris: 1:22:35

The problem was it was after CJ and it was after the fight, so Peterson was feeling some type of way. Peterson was looking around, going, oh yeah, we're going to enjoy this. He was coming into Peterson like, oh no, smalls, we're going to enjoy this, oh yeah. He was coming into Peterson like, oh no, smalls, we're going to enjoy this. It's our time right now. We've been shy, we're going to enjoy this. Payback is a mother.

chris: 1:23:02

But even then, watching the movie originally, you just assumed that he's just going to beat his ass, right? You never saw what actually happened coming. You're just like he's just going to beat his ass, right? You never saw what actually happened coming. You're just like they're just going to beat his ass. You're going to get his lick back, yes, but what you've seen was the same hatred that Waters had for CJ. Peterson had for Waters. Yep, the same exact hatred. Yep, yeah. And again, that's where I was Hated him to the core. Yeah, that was the premature. I shot my load already. But it, but it did just.

chris: 1:23:37

It highlighted to me how they were the same person. They were the same man. He hated Sergeant Waters the same way Sergeant Waters hated CJ, and I feel like they were all trying to further the black race, absolutely, absolutely. And they both probably saw CJ as a country step and fetch. They both probably saw him the same way. But Peterson kind of understood, like that's just who CJ is, leave the boy alone, he ain't hurting nobody. Yeah, that's my brother, that's my brother. Waters saw it is. But these white people see CJ and they gonna think I'm supposed to talk like that yes sir, no sir, and stuff like that. So it was just. And then Peterson saw you as the bootlicker that you were. Yes, see, that's how it went all A full circle. Peterson saw him in a certain way too.

chris: 1:24:22

The perspectives was the writing of Peterson saw him like he saw CJ. Yes, the writing was crazy in this movie. It was brilliant, the screenplay was brilliant when Peterson is kicking him down and stuff like that. That's why I know the writing was so good.

chris: 1:24:44

I felt a certain type of way about the death of Waters because when he saw compassion he said Pete, in a turn of endearment, like son. It was almost like he was saying son, which showed that he respected Peterson. But Peterson had so much hate for Waters because of what happened to CJ, it was just like he couldn't get past. Like I can finally get my lick back for the fight and for CJ while this man is drunk. He couldn't get past that, you know. No, he couldn't get past it. So when Waters was saying what he was saying as a drunk man to Peterson and he ended it, he was saying even after all the diabolicalness and clearing all the Geechee's out the way, they still hate you. Yes, sir, peterson, that's enough of this shit. We done, we done, we done Because Peterson, go back to the night CJ was arrested, like you said the writing.

chris: 1:25:45

So they're going to kill. Yeah, I've seen this before. They're going to kill him. Somebody going to kill him. Yeah, I've seen this before. They're going to kill him. Somebody's going to kill him. Sure, did say that. When he's putting on his clothes. Yep, I got to go over there and talk to him, officer, because they're going to kill him. They're going to kill him. No, but Peterson was talking about waters. Peterson was talking about waters at that time. They're going to kill him. He said he's seen it somewhere else where they killed the Sarge. Yeah, somebody who was acting like Sarge was acting. Yeah, peterson comes in.

chris: 1:26:16

Peterson goes straight up to Smalls. He sees Smalls crying. He already know. Yeah, he goes up to him. It's a wrap. I'm told yeah, yep, snitching ass.

chris: 1:26:24

I told him he started smiling that evil Denzel smile. He told her punk ass, motherfucker. That's what he wanted to say. He didn't even have, he didn't even hate Smalls enough to even hit Smalls, because normally you get your ass beat for snitching. But he never hated Smalls and he kind of understood. I did kind of punk him into being with me that night and letting that happen. I can't really be mad at Smalls. I did kind of punk him into being with me that night, letting that happen, like I can't really be mad at Smalls. I did kind of punk him into this shit as much as you know. Hey, I did what I was supposed to do. Yes, he had the justification. Unfortunately I'm caught, but I did my job. He felt like he was fully justified.

chris: 1:27:09

Some things need to get rid of. Some black people need to to get rid of, some black people need to be getting rid of, and that's when. That's when Davenport was like. But who made you the judge and the jury of who is fit to be a black person? And Peterson didn't have an answer for that. No, because he understood. Oh, I fucked up. Yep, I probably shouldn't have done that. Yep, you can say a lot of bad shit about how evil Waters is, and we've sat here and said it because Waters has evil.

chris: 1:27:33

He was a motherfucker, but a lot of it had to do with his upbringing. A lot of it had to do with he was a fucking drunk. Yeah, that too, let's get that out the way. He was a drunk also. He was a tormented man, but Peterson was a clear thinker. So when Peterson pulled the trigger, he knew exactly what he was doing.

chris: 1:27:53

Yeah, pete was diabolical. Pete was a savage bro. Pete was a savage Pete. Honestly, I feel like Pete was waiting for that time to happen. We're going to run up on this motherfucker. I'm going to get him. And I'm going to get him Whether it's around a corner, when he's barracks, yeah, when he's stumbling. So I'm gonna get him. Yeah, pete had it in his mind. This is the. That's why he looked. He's like oh no, we're gonna enjoy this. We are not gonna go nowhere, we're gonna enjoy this. It was so evil the way he said it. He looked around like, oh no, we gonna enjoy this, all this shit talking you been doing to us.

chris: 1:28:36

Yep, so after Davenport says, you know, tells the guard, take these men out. I was hoping he was saying take these niggas up out of here. He didn't say niggas, he even gave him respect. He said get these men out of here. He didn't say niggas, he even gave him respect. He said get these men out of here. That's it. When they get let out, when they take them out, he goes to the window. He looks out it's raining, great shot. He just starts crying.

chris: 1:29:03

I took that as a symbol of look what we're doing to ourselves. That's 100% what it was. We all here trying to be positive black people in the military, and look what the fuck we did to ourselves. We made the shit worse. You got two motherfuckers going to jail. Three because Wilkie, three people probably going to jail for life. Two dead Ain't a white person had nothing to do with none of that. So I think when he was crying, that's what that cry was about. Look at the hate within. It's the hate within. It's an incredible scene, with no words and just looking out the window crying.

chris: 1:29:43

I was like fuck, damn, that shit hurt him, that he came all the way from Washington to have to lock up two of his brothers, two black men, over killing a black man. He did not come from Washington to find that out. No, he didn't. No, he didn't. Yeah, he wasn't on the train because, remember, when he first got there, corporal Ellis was like the KKK did it right. He said out the gate. He was like when they killed him. And Davenport was like what you mean they? Why you saying that? He was like well, the KKK did it Right. He said out the gate. He was like when they killed him. And Davenport was like what you mean they? He was like well, the KKK did it Right. So he just knew Off, rip, that's what it was. We in the South KKK, yeah, man God.

chris: 1:30:21

But we get to a point where Davenport the case is over Got the man. Davenport is leaving and gets a ride from Taylor. Taylor, who still seems to be the nice guy saying you got your man. He even apologized. He's like I was wrong. Taylor said I was wrong. Davenport said I was wrong too. We both thought we had the right person. We were both wrong. Taylor says well, I better get used to seeing black men in uniform. And it was a great line. Davenport was like yeah, you better bet your ass, you better get used to it. That was a great way to end it. That was a great way to end it we coming, we coming and then the final that was the Deion Sanders of the 40s we coming.

chris: 1:31:07

So the final shot was the credits rolling and the soldiers walking up the hill. It was a great shot, incredibly great shot, to add, on their way to do what they were there to do in the first place. Yeah, which is all they wanted to do. They finally was going to war. Yes, they finally was going to war. Yeah, and all that frustration in them sitting in the barracks and sitting on base not doing nothing. They finally get to fight To where they was even bragging at it at one point Hitler, we coming to get your ass, we coming to get your ass, that's it. That's right. They were so excited. Yes, they were so excited. It was just now.

chris: 1:31:51

Let me ask you this, as a military person Is that how it is, when you're on a base, that you just want to see battle. One hundred percent, one hundred percent. You ready to get shot. One hundred percent, because that, that is what you're indoctrinated with from day one. That's what they're bringing you to do. That's what you signed the contract for to volunteer any and everything up until your life.

chris: 1:32:16

Personal story I got it 100%. I was in during Operation Iraqi Freedom. I was slated to go to Iraq twice. First time I was literally on the tarmac and got called away Damn. Second time the order just didn't go through, where I didn't catch up. And as a young man, I was very disappointed because I wanted to go overseas and get some in. Wow, as an old man, I sit here now and count my blessings and thankful that I didn't have to go into that situation. But yeah, I was at the time of service. I was very upset that I did not get to go.

chris: 1:32:53

But again, it's a real thing, it's a very real thing. It's a very real thing as a civilian. We don't think that people would want to go into battle. But when you're in that situation, that's what you're training for, that's what you're working for. That's what you're training for. That's what you're working for. That's a good point. What's the point of doing all that training, you ain't never going to use it. That's it, I get it. I get it.

chris: 1:33:17

It was like they were having a day, they were celebrating. Yeah, literally, we got their orders to go fight. We getting ready to go fuck some shit up, because at that time again, you're a young man, At that time again you're a young man, you're full of testosterone. You have been told that you're the greatest since sliced bread and you got all the tools to go and whoop some ass. And they are making you ready to go whoop ass. Yeah, you do, I tell you. At that time you could tell me shit. Okay, say what. I eat rounds of 200 rounds or eat bullets of 200 yards away and shit, constantino wires, we was, I mean, we was ready, we was ready, you know. And you have to be Ready and well trained. Yeah, because when you're going to put it all on the line, you gotta be, and so you can't go in there timid, you can't go in there, you know. Second guessing.

chris: 1:34:08

Now, is it true that a lot of soldiers in the military don't like having contact with their families because it takes their mind off the assignment For a lot, for a lot. Yeah, ok, that's. That's a reason why I didn't get married in the military. I didn't want that connection. You know, even the day I got activated to go to Iraq and my mother and my girlfriend at the time they're the ones that dropped me off and I was begging and pleading Mom, don't know, don't, don't take me, don't take, because I don't want this, I don't want this to be the memory of me. It's last seeing his memory. I don't want that. You know that's deep. So, yeah, that, know that all these things run into our psyche. You know that's deep.

chris: 1:34:54

I'm thankful that, even though my dad was a military man, he never saw no action, because I always think about I might not be. Yeah, what happened? Real talk, chris don't exist. A lot of guys went back and didn't come back. Yeah, right, real talk. So, yeah, I was always thankful for that. But uh, even though he didn't talk about it a lot, I knew the way he behaved and how disciplined my father was. He was a very proud military man. He was very proud of that shit. He was very proud Because it's an accomplishment. It's an accomplishment you know what I'm saying Especially his day he got drafted. It was the drafted day. You had to go into the military. You turn 18, go ask for the military. That was it. You didn't get a choice, like everybody does now, oh, they phasing that out too, but that's a whole other show. Yeah, that's a whole other thing. Thank the Lord, I'm 50 something, right, right, I'm thankful. Now I can't go back, but I got boys, so I got to get them ready. Boys, yeah.

chris: 1:35:53

So the extra stuff about this particular movie Soldier Story 1984. It received three Academy Award nominations for Best Picture, best Screenplay and Best Supporting Actor. Adolph Caesar he had Best Supporting Actor over the lead role. He had Best Supporting Actor over the lead role. That's how good he was. That's how good he was. If you didn't hate Waters, oh gosh, but you had to have a lot of hate for him. You had to. Like I said, even in my hate for him he was humanized. I got it why he was that way, and so I gave him a benefit of a doubt. And Adolph Caesar, yeah, he just brought it all the way home. Yeah, rest in peace, adolph Caesar. Any family members, he did a hell of a job. Y'all should still to this day, y'all should be very proud of the job he did, very proud, shout out and rest in peace to Adolph Season.

chris: 1:36:49

I humanized him myself because, like I told you, I saw a lot of my dad in that character. My dad thought the same exact way. He didn't go diabolical, trying to get rid of people, but he would not deal with anybody in our race who acted foolishly. He wasn't fucking, you know my dad, it was only a couple of dudes. He hung with your father, ralph, didn't. He wasn't fucking. You know my day, it was only a couple of dudes. He hung with your father, right, ralph, right, right, yeah, for 50 years. Outside of that he was like nah, they all coons, we ain't doing all this. You know I'm saying he only hang with dudes. He knew was reputable.

chris: 1:37:23

That character had families. All our fathers were married with kids. You had to have a certain lifestyle for my father to even deal with you Exactly. He didn't have no time for no bullshit. He didn't put no foolishness Again.

chris: 1:37:37

I'm glad to even get to say on camera rest in peace. Mr Ellis, you were an example of what a real man was. So I'm thankful. I am thankful to have been in his company in my young days. So I'm thankful, I am thankful to have been in his company in my young days, you know, so thankful we appreciate that he would sacrifice, and not only sacrifice his life for all them kids at the daycare. But he would whoop your ass like he was his child too, and rightfully so.

chris: 1:38:08

But we knew he loved us. I knew your dad loved me. Yeah, come on, come on, jero, what you doing? All right, we going. And he celebrated with me too, like you said, we went to Disneyland. Yeah, yeah, he took me to Universal Studios. Solid dude, solid man, solid dude. Come on, come on, let me show you. I got you. Yeah, you know you ain't gonna fuck up if you do. I'm on. Yeah, yeah, but I'm a celebrate, you too. And what example is that? That's, that's manhood, that's manhood, that's man, it's solid dude. So I saw I humanized Sergeant Waters because, like I said, I saw a lot of my dad in that character. Who, waters, only wanted the best for black people. That's what people got to understand. As evil as he seemed, he really only wanted the best for black people and he thought that certain people, like CJ, was the opposite of. That Would only make us look the worst to white people.

chris: 1:39:05

Going back to the movie nobody wanted to make this movie back in 1984. These studios are not fucking with this movie. No, they're not this type of stuff. No, no, you had to be fooling and cooning Black Soldiers and World War II was not saying in 1984. And basically every actor had to take a pay cut to get it done, straight up. And even the director said he would do it for free. Free, but the union wouldn't let him do it for free. That's how serious it got. People was going to take pay cuts and do it for free because the story meant so much. And when you watch it all these years later you see how important this story is. So again, it was just. It was such a great representation of the black experience in this nation.

chris: 1:39:52

I know, and I love period pieces. I'm just, I just love period pieces. But because the screenplay was written so well, it just. I fell in love with this movie First time I saw it. Even when I saw it again a week, a week ago, I fell back, all back in. Yes, that's why I love this movie. It stays in rotation. It's a real movie. If I was going to imagine what my ancestors went through in the military, I would imagine it would be this movie. This is what the fuck they went through, like real talk.

chris: 1:40:23

Also, side note, bill Clinton, who at the time was the governor of Arkansas. He was on set, so he was there to see this movie through and visit with the fellas and stuff like that. Like Bill Clinton before the presidency, yeah, yeah, I've got that tidbit too to where the budget had ran low and there was no way that they would be able to shoot that last scene. But he, he enacted that was National Guard, yes, so he enacted them in order to to do that scene with the passing review, you know. But that shout out to Bill Clinton for supporting that movement and shout out and getting that done.

chris: 1:41:02

So I want, I need you to rate it. So scale from one to ten, seven being good, eight being great, nine being excellent and ten being a masterpiece classic. What do you give? I got to give a masterpiece classic of a ten. I'm on that too. I have to, I can't say no other way. Yeah, because it just touched every part of our experience. Yeah, and framed it so beautifully in the background of military. I mean, they could have told that story with different backgrounds. Yeah, it could have been told, but they could have wrapped it up quick and had the white guys go to the airport, yeah, but they just put it in. That was our existence. Yes, that's what we lived in at that time.

chris: 1:41:49

Like I said, the first scene with Davenport on the bus fucked me up from the very beginning. Right, you let this white dude call you boy, boy, you a fucking captain. But it's in the South, yep, 1944. That's the way it goes. If he would have said anything the opposite, they might have lynched him right in the air. Yeah, he could have been a dead captain for real. They might have lynched him right in the air. He could have been a dead captain. He's been a dead captain. He called him boy about five times hey boy, hey boy.

chris: 1:42:15

In a disrespectful way, not in a nice way, right, it was very disrespectful. So that got me from the very beginning. I don't know how they did it. I don't know how they lived through a time where you could be blatantly disrespected like that, but that was life. It was life. So I get it, it was life. I just had the pleasure of coming back from Black Wall Street and were we suckers? No, not at all. But we, just you couldn't stand against the establishment, you know, in a way that would alleviate that type of treatment to where somebody is still, to this day, think they got the right to disrespect you because of the show, is the main ingredient, main ingredient. So, in your words, what was the main ingredient, the one thing in this movie that made you give it a 10. The one thing, and it could be anything about the movie, but the one thing.

chris: 1:43:17

To sum it up in a word classism. Hmm, explain, because they, they just dissected it so beautifully and showed each and every area of which it encompasses. And we got to realize, the people watching this got to realize that's the real enemy that we up against. And it don't matter what color you are. You know, it just breeds in that way to make you fight against your own color. It does when that's not the enemy. Right, you are exactly right.

chris: 1:43:55

The gap between a have and a have nots have nothing to do with color. No more. It is classism. Only, you either got money or you don't got money. That's it A have and a have nots. There's a lot of broke white people as well as a lot of broke black people as well as a lot of broke black people as well as a lot of broke Asians and Mexicans, like broke people exist everywhere, everywhere, yeah, everywhere. It's a class thing more than a race thing and I wish people really understand that and learn how to navigate through that. There's a game in play that we're all playing as we get through life, you know, financially and stuff like that. There's a game that's going on and people don't understand how to play the game because they don't understand the rules Exactly. You know what I'm saying and it's unfortunate that people give up before they understand how to play the game of life and get through it on on the good side of it. You know what I'm saying and I wish a lot of people wouldn't wouldn't give up like figure, understand how to play the game of life and get through it on on the good side of it. You know what I'm saying and I wish a lot of people wouldn't wouldn't give up like figure.

chris: 1:44:54

Look, I got the mentality of and I catch a lot of flack from my friends for this like I kind of somewhat agree with damon dash what he said on the breakfast club a few years ago. It's all a mentality thing. If I only want to fly first class, I going to figure out a way to make more money, first class, I'm not going to say. I'm not going to say, well, I'm going to fly, coach, because I can't afford it. No, motherfucker, figure out how to come up with money for first class. But it's a mentality. There's a poor mentality and a go-getter mentality. And I get in trouble a lot of times because I'll be looking at a lot of my friends like won't you just learn how to make more money? Stop complaining about not having enough money. It's a class thing.

chris: 1:45:38

I refuse to catch the bus to go across country. So if my ticket going to cost me $2,000, I'm going to figure out how to make $2,000. I'm not going to say, well, I guess I got to catch the bus, figure out how to make $2,000. I'm not going to say, well, I guess I got to catch the bus. No, I'm not doing that, no more. And I wish more people had that mentality, the Dame Dash mentality.

chris: 1:45:57

Learn how to own shit, learn how to be owners. Granted, everybody can't be an owner, we get that. But you can have a better life if you become a go-getter and you desire and go work for yeah, you can have a nine to five and have a side hustle where you can afford that nice ticket to Vegas or that nice ticket to Miami. You don't have to say, well, I only make $20 an hour, so I can't do it. No, you can do it. You can, yes, you can, believe in yourself, make it happen. You just got to have the desire.

chris: 1:46:28

And it's hard to put that belief in. When somebody doesn't believe in themselves, it's hard for you to believe in them too. Right, I can't believe more for you. Yeah, I can't. I can't want it more than you. It's impossible. I can't want it more than you. So it's just like. I just want people to understand.

chris: 1:46:45

Like, the game that's being played now is a classism game. It's not a race game. And don't let the race baiters put you in there. Yeah, it's not a race thing. No, no, it's class. Right, and it's getting bigger by the day. By the day. The wealth gap is increasing daily, and you guys got to figure it out. There is no beetle. There is no reason why less than one percent of the population has more wealth than the rest of the population Ridiculous. There's no excuse. And as long as they keep you thinking that it's, it's by design, you know it's by design, of course. And now, now we get into the bread and butter of it.

chris: 1:47:27

But you know, even back in the days of slavery it was, it was so intricately. Whether the Winley Lynch letters are true or not, the framework exists, and even so, much so that you know, they brought in the Irish who was, for lack of a better term the niggas, the white people, yes, you know. The lower class, yeah, niggas. And the white, yeah, they brought you and put you over, put them over the slave, you know, to create some type of division. And now they were. They were grafted into the criteria of white. You know, these white and black and these, we ain't colors, but but it's the separating line. It's the separating line, you know. Yeah, and and then that was one way. And then, to make us do what we do amongst ourselves, make us the Sergeant Waters and the Petersons or whatever.

chris: 1:48:17

Dr Claude Anderson talked about meritorious manumissions, where you were rewarded for making sure to take down your brother If they were getting together and said we're going to escape, we're going to get rid of this. And one of y'all heard and went and told you got rewarded, you got meritorious manumissions. It was a legal stature for you telling in order to break up the revolution. You know so and that's just. It's just on repeat to today. That's a good point For me.

chris: 1:48:48

Going to the main ingredient. The main ingredient, the main ingredient for this movie for me is the screenplay. I just love how it was written. You could tell they put so much thought into every word on the page. There was no words wasted, none, none, not a one. Some movies you can look at and say they didn't have to put that there. There was not one word wasted. It's not one word wasted.

chris: 1:49:16

It's like when people say well, chris, you haven't done a movie in 10 years, why you ain't done a movie? If I can't do some shit like that, I won't be doing a movie. When I do something, I want to do something. That means something. I'm not going to be a dude who's going to have 20 movies on Tubi that don't mean shit to nobody but me. Oh Lord, shout out hey, I'm not hating on the Tubi director. Get your money, get your bread, because a lot of y'all are getting rich off that Cool. That ain't me. My movies got to matter to me. That's why I only got one feature film in 10 years. It matter to me, that's just me. Movies like this is why I became a filmmaker, and these type of movies drive me to do more in film.

chris: 1:49:56

It's just when it comes to, I take it so serious I can't just put any bullshit out there. Man, my name is on it. When I'm long gone, they're going to look at these films. So are they going to see a bunch of bullshit on Tubi? Are they going to see a real ass movie? That's the difference with me. I think about when I'm gone. That's the testament to your character, man, that's the testament. And I think a lot of directors not even just black, just directors in general of this new generation they're not thinking about what's going to be left when I'm gone. Is it going to be movies that matter or movies that don't mean shit? It's about to bag. It's 40, 50 years later.

chris: 1:50:33

We still talking about the, the, this movie, and we still talking about the performance of Adolf Caesar yes, that's how well he did his job. Yes, yes, yes. And Howard Rollins All ofins, that's how well they did their jobs. So I want to be taken the same exact way when I do my movies. You know what I'm saying.

chris: 1:50:54

So to me, the main ingredient was definitely the screenplay. It was just incredible. It was incredibly well written screenplay, no words wasted. The casting was perfect. You know, because them was gorillas, oh my Perfect. You know, because them was gorillas, oh my God. You know you got the Gorillas. You got the prime versions of these dudes. God, prime Denzel, prime, denzel Prime David Allen, greer Prime Robert Townsend. You know, oh goodness, you got them right there in the beginning when they had that young hunger. Let's get this done, let's get this work in, um, but no, you know, I want to thank you, gerald, for coming through. Man, you are always welcome. This was a blessing to have you here.

chris: 1:51:43

A man from the military to talk about a military movie. Even though it was 1944, you explain like some of the shit is still similar to his day. So you know, same time, same things happen. So I'm glad we got the experience from somebody who actually lived that life and understand what. You know what it takes to be in those positions of authority. You know you say Marine, right, yeah, I was in the Marine Corps.

chris: 1:52:09

Yeah, you know, I knew a guy named thomas alexander right in, uh, one of the jobs I was working at a warehouse and he was a marine and uh, unfortunately he killed himself. He committed suicide. But I had a lot of conversations with him and I'll never forget, uh, I had gotten trouble. You know, talking shit at work or whatever and stuff, that's what you do, that's what I do. I just talk shit. You know, talking shit at work or whatever and stuff, that's what you do, that's what I do. I just talk shit. You know, that comes from my parents. But he was, he had just became a supervisor. They had a program going where they was letting military guys run the warehouses. So he became my supervisor, kind of overnight yeah, and I was next up to be the assistant supervisor, okay, so before he got there I was already in position not to be super by the assistant, so they put me right next to him when he got the job and over months he started telling me little gems about what he went through and stuff like that, what he had seen in his world and stuff. And it amazed me the shit he had seen in his dream.

chris: 1:53:10

Yeah, not even just the death. Yeah, the shitty scene of life, of life. It exposes you to a whole different world. You know, I'm very thankful. You know people ask why y'all so gung-ho? And you know, especially Marines, yeah, especially Marines. Yeah, Especially Marines. Why, and you know, especially Marines, especially Marines. Why? Because we say you know, in other services you go through and you get the title right. You do the boot camp and you get the title. But seriously, for Marine Corps it's earned. It is earned. They are disqualifying people from becoming Marines, so you earn it and you never let go of it for what you were put through.

chris: 1:54:01

And rest in peace to my brother who passed away, and again, I don't know the man, but he's still my brother. That's how we are. Even our ones who represent the Colonel Nivens and the disrespectful ones, I mean, they still are brother. Yeah, you know it's that tight, but we are. We're losing a lot. You know 22 a day is the is. I don't know if you've seen that, you know in social media throughout the last 10 years or so, but we're losing 22 day, 22 veterans a day to suicide. You know an average. And because, for some, for the things they've been subject to overseas and the jobs they've had to do, and some for the stuff that goes in. You know, during our service, yeah, at home, you know it's a different way, it's a different lifestyle and and when you step away from it. It can have that effect on you to ultimately uh unalive yourself because you don't know where you fit.

chris: 1:55:03

Yeah, he was a, he was such he was. And let me take, let me uh tell you he was a white guy, yeah, yeah, and he used to say stuff all the time to me like I believe in you, the only white guy that ever told me he believes in me. Yeah, he said but, chris, I believe that you can become the general manager of this warehouse and you, because people respect you, you the OG, they respect you. He's like I believe in you. Only white person wife ever told me that my entire life and it felt organic, like it was he really did. Yeah, yeah, you know, and don't. Yeah, and you know why, because of what he's been through.

chris: 1:55:39

Yeah, so don't take it for a grain of salt that he said that because if we call it blow a smoke, he wouldn't be blowing up smoke up. Yeah, he definitely wouldn't smoke up my ass and and and thomas, thomas alexander, he was definitely, he was definitely a solid one, he was a real one man and I, I was sad when I heard that he uh unalived itself. Yeah, but, um, you know, people go through things in life. Like I said, he told, he told me some of the stuff he saw. Like he said there's a part of the world where where it's dark and light at the same time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm like that shit exists For real. He's like Chris, I've seen some shit that you wouldn't fucking believe. Like there's a part of the world where you can see daylight and nighttime at the same time. Yeah, yeah, like what? Right, you know and I was. You know I didn't get to see a whole lot, but what I saw and I'm grateful for, you know.

chris: 1:56:33

But juxtaposed to you know, my father, who did again 30 years as a Marine, first black flight engineer that the Marine Corps ever had, he's been around the world 12 and a half times. Jesus, you know, I never knew that. 12 and a half times, I never knew. I never knew that Twelve and a half times, I never knew that, yeah, and he served, and he served under the conditions that you know the movie predicts Because you got to remember the movie was World War Two, 1944, right, the Marine Corps didn't actually start letting black troops until 1942. Damn, the Marine Corps started in 177575 but they did not start admitting black troops to be marines until 1942.

chris: 1:57:15

I did not know that. Okay, 200 years later, okay, okay, that's deep right, you know. I mean, we served in the navy and the army and all those times, before every major battle that this country has had, we've had African-American soldiers. Yeah, we've been there, we fought and died, you know. But again, it just highlights number one the tenacity of our people. You know, it does highlight some of the bad parts of this country too, though. Yes, for treating people less than thinking that they weren when. Truthfully, when we, when we get in there, we shine and we are just as deserving, we are just as capable.

chris: 1:58:00

I have an uncle named Freddie who was killed in the military in the 50s, and my grandmother really never got over the loss of her son, but it was friendly fire. You never learned a true story about it. Even now, the family's still trying to find out what the fuck happened. Yeah, but it was the 50s, it was in the south. Who knows who killed my damn uncle. Like, I'm just keeping it real, no, real 100, but we know it wasn't the, the ops. Right, right, right, probably Al Cracker, al Cracker. Yeah, al Cracker is real. Just keep it real, al Cracker is real, but anyway, I want to thank you for coming, jero. Thank you, bro. Tell them where they can find you. Oh, you know everything.

chris: 1:58:40

Bealsauce, that's what I do. I live and breathe. I don't even really have no personal social media. I'm working on that. Bealsauce, yeah, bealsauce, b-e-a-l-e, bravo, Echo, alpha, lima, echo your military folks will get that. But yeah, bealsaucecom and that's all socials, everything at Bealsauce. Okay, yeah, so thank you, brother. You just heard it from Mr Williams when to find him. Once again, I'm the host, chris Ellis, and this is the main ingredient.